Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

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    Kyat

    Messages : 1603
    Date d'inscription : 30/05/2010
    Age : 30
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    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Kyat le Lun 21 Juil 2014 - 21:43

    J'aime bien le store.
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Lun 21 Juil 2014 - 21:49

    Il est là depuis le tout début. Depuis il n'a jamais changé d'un poil.
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Jeu 31 Juil 2014 - 21:20

    Le truc dont parlais ClemsPaw sur les vêtements des morts, j'y suis actuellement confronté.

    Mon but final sur le projet de bureau 3D c'est d'avoir une scène vue du point de vue d'un client (Celso) assis sur la chaise et qui tient en main une brochure du 9 Express avec en arrière plan l'ordinateur sur lequel on distingue qu'il n'a droit à rien. J'ai donc commencé à modéliser les os de l'avant bras (il manque la main, effet amputation, âmes sensibles s'abstenir). Sur ces os, j'ai ajouté une manche. Mais en lançant la simulation (il y a une simulation physique du mouvement des vêtements, j'ai juste à faire une manche cylindre et elle se déforme toute seule, pas besoin de faire les plis à la main), j'ai obtenu le résultat suivant :

    http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/16/84/98/78/render11.png

    C'est donc à ça que ressembleraient des vêtements sur les morts si on ne trichait pas.

    J'ai triché en créant deux os identiques mais orientés à l'horizontale. J'ai masqué ces os mais les ai pris en compte pour la simulation. J'ai obtenu le résultat suivant :

    http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/16/84/98/78/render10.png

    C'est un peu moins bizarre, mais un peu moins juste. Il y a donc bel et bien anguille sous roche et les graphistes 3D qui ont travaillé sur le jeu ont bien triché eux même.
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Jeu 7 Aoû 2014 - 0:06

    Salut! Sadly I don't speak much french. But saw your post on the Grim Fandango Net forum and wanted to ask if I can help out a bit?

    Great details in the models so far!
    What kind of renderer is being used?

    best regards, kunlan
    also know as sallim on gf.net
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    Shad

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    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Jeu 7 Aoû 2014 - 0:18

    Hi, the first 7 versions have been generated using Yafaray but I switched a few weeks ago to Cycles (Blender's new internal renderer): a bit slower and noisier than Yafaray's photon mapping mode but materials (there aren't any yet) are easier to set up since it makes use of Blender's node system and provides a wider choice of basic shaders. The bone test render is Blender Internal + freestyle. You can help out if you like, no problem. What would you like to work on?
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Jeu 7 Aoû 2014 - 14:32

    Thank you for the info! I am using 3dsmax, (with vray or corona) but not good with shaders ( as of yet )
    I could provide some old LSA models with textures from old fan art I did.
    http://www.grim-fandango.com/comments.php?type=fan_art&id=16
    Sal was ripped though.

    Don't wanna interrupt the flow here, but have these files lying around for such a long time, I thought they could get useful.
    Best regards,

    Kunlan
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Jeu 7 Aoû 2014 - 18:35

    Nice work. Not good with shaders either, but I plan to (or at least, I plan not to make people's eyes explode anymore). What you've got here is far more advanced than what I obtained in WIP #4b and #4c (admittedly there were no texures, which didn't help). Blender's cycles really seems to make the process way more powerful and user friendly. I hope it will help.

    Sal and other characters might come in handy, how did you rip it from the game? Although I did not plan to show characters in the final scene, having a basic Celso (or Sal, it doesn't matter) who would provide a basis for reflexion in the screen will be unavoidable (you cannot have a forearm and a hand holding a piece of paper in mid air, the computer screen would give it away and I'm not skilled enough to model an entire detailed Celso from scratch).

    Unfortunately, most of your models have either been already redone (e.g. that damn curvy desk, took me days to get it right) or do not belong in Manny's office. If you're interested anyway, you can work on anything you want that is left to be done (and that includes a lot of stuff, from little details to important things). Check on the first post and look at the date: as you can see, the flow is already quite slow and interrupts on itself. You would not slow it down further. On the contrary, the worst you could do is boosting it a bit. I understand you're used to 3dsmax. I'm working with Blender. That is not a problem: files can be imported/exported from/to *.3ds files among other file formats. Let's keep in touch anyway whatever your decision is.

    Best regards
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Ven 8 Aoû 2014 - 20:54

    Thanks. I took a closer look to all the details you have added, really nice work, especially on the wall and ceiling. I also hated the curvy desk, what a pain. I didn't even bother to get the keyboard done, so congrats to you for this extraordinary work.

    I could post some smaller stuff from the office. The sofa/couch and books and would post them here.

    The Sal 3d model was out of the demo of GF. As far as I remember I used an 3do exporter from Jedi Knight for the files and surprisingly it worked (but only on the demo files )

    But time has passed and you can export and convert ( even convert back ) the models from the game!
    The Project is called Grim Fandango Deluxe and cplhenshaw created a model viewer and converter =)
    Here are more info about GF files :
    http://forums.residualvm.org/viewtopic.php?p=2536#2536

    I wanted to ask, if the plan was to recreate the office alone or do even more? My French is not very good to translate the first post, but from what I understand from the GF.net forums post, its only this scene?

    3ds suits me fine too, its a good thing to work with them.
    keep up the good work,

    Best regards,
    Kunlan
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Sam 9 Aoû 2014 - 14:37

    The keyboard was one of the hardest things. I've looked at dozens of reference images of old-fashioned and modern typewriters. I've started from scratch many times. I finally decided to go for the ingame design we have a closer look on when interacting on the computer with Manny.

    The plan is to recreate the office alone (putting emphasis on the desk part). However, a basic corridor will have to be textured and lit to provide stuff to see through the glass door (nothing more than 4 walls and light sources). Same thing for El Marrow skyscrapers though a render might be generated separately and used as a background image on the outside. If I were to model buildings in the same scene, it would increase render time, so let's do it when everything else looks nice and finished.

    A brief (well... actually not so brief) todo list:


    • Couch
    • Ashtray (couch zone)
    • Manny's retractable scyte (even if Manny's not going to be in the room, I'd like his scyte to be leant over the wall next to the tube in order to show that he's not far away, I want to give the impression he's just left to sign some documents or that he deliberately left Celso alone for a moment). I also think, since the ingame scyte is really low poly, that this is a chance to give it details (like screws and hinges).
    • Some files and messy folders (that kind of thing http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/sites/default/files/styles/insert_small/public/images/1068/messy-folders.jpg?itok=VMnbO7YY, not that tall though) to be scattered across the room (mostly on the desk and client table)
    • Books (a blender addon enables the user to generate already uv-unwraped books, (check out http://vimeo.com/90801687 )  so let's ignore that for the moment, we might put unnecessary effort into it)
    • Manny's desk chair (which is currently the same as the client's)
    • Details on the tube (handle + little flag)
    • New (more detailed) "totems" (those things on each side of the desk)
    • New ceiling lamp.
    • Cables (from the typewriter to the screen, between plugs on the front panels, between the desk lamp and a wall plug that would also have to be modeled). I'm sure there is a way to make use of Blender's physics simulator. Let's not bother with that.
    • Bas-relief on the arches (desk). I'd like it to be actual polygons and not bump mapping, like the ceiling and that triangles+circles sculpture (it's called "frise" in French, I don't know what's the English for it).
    • The corner thing between the "frise" on the longer walls and the minimalist "frise" on the shorter walls.
    • Celso's hand holding the Number 9 flyer (the one I'm still not allowed to use Very Happy ). I'm not sure that a realistic skeleton hand is the best idea. It may look creepy. When you look at some fan art that reproduces characters in a realistic way, it's often terrifying. Nevertheless, we cannot afford the ingame too low poly model. We'll have to go for a fair balance between the calavera look and an actual skeleton. In my opinion, we should base our model on reference x-ray images of real hands, and then add those sort of black connectors between bones that give the overall thing the famous traditional calavera style. Blender freestyle renderer can also help us to add black outlines (like in the bone test render).
    • The four musicians figurine (not a big fan of it, and definitely not skilled enough to model it with enough details). It's not a big deal if we don't make it.


    I'm sure I'm forgetting stuff. But this is a good start. We will never achieve all these tasks and some of them may be removed, new ones added. This isn't important. The real aim of this project, above generating a final image, is having fun doing it. Take all the time you need and only work on it if and when you enjoy doing it.

    When I'm working on the project, I use two references: ingame screenshots and the original concept art. These two references are slightly different and it doesn't matter. It also doesn't matter if you take some liberties. If you've got an idea, do it, do not try to check if it fits the original images. Feel free to try whatever you think is right.

    I'll also export resources you need (just tell me what you need) to 3DS file format.
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 14:09

    Thanks Shad for the nice todo list. Looks like a good plan.
    To have fun is probably the most appealing aspect for me, creates a nice atmosphere for this project atleast for me =)
    I am kinda tempted to try the four musicians , maybe later. But this really depends how good they can turn out. The reference images for them should be there ( especially in the end sequence )
    Will take some preparations first and see how it works out.

    So far I am good and don't need 3ds resources, but thank you nonetheless. Will let you know if there was progress from my side.

    Also thank you for the kind welcome, I feel very comfortable here.

    Best Regards,

    Kunlan

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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 14:27

    The main title image might also be used:


    Good luck with the musicians.

    Do you need the basic base I have modeled (not uv-unwrapped yet) for the coral?


    I think I'm going to work on the scyte next.
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 16:49

    Nice work man, the postcards look very nice! How long does it take to render it in this kind of quality ?
    Sure, would be nice to have it.
    The Musicians don't scare me that much yet, but the instruments kind of. Ajajaj.

    Here is the final shot from GF
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 19:26

    I started with the most left guy from the intro scene, with the blue "hat".Many things are off yet.(no hands!Manny :D) Have to research about small details of the upright bass. Its rather a scale test , than anything else. More coming soon.

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    Shad

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    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 19:35

    It already looks awesome. I'm really not into character design. Which were the steps you've followed to end up with the result above? Did you start with a basic shape like a cube and then sliced and extruded it along the reference image ?
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 10 Aoû 2014 - 20:35

    Actually, me neither. I have a bad topology as far as I can tell.
    But yes, you said it. Started with a cube and sliced everything into shape. The good thing about the musician is, that they are rather low poly, found it easier to guess structure. Hat came first, to get a feeling for the proportions for the head and body size. Will see how it comes along =)
    Wish you a nice sunday evening,
    kunlan
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Lun 11 Aoû 2014 - 0:21

    Have you tried subdividing it (in Blender subdivision is a modifier, it means you work on the low poly model and the hi poly one evolves accordingly)? Sometimes I've noticed it just sort of works out of the box on low poly models (with a few tweaks here and there).
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Mer 13 Aoû 2014 - 18:16

    Hey Shad, yes I usually work like that. Good point you found here. I noticed that small changes can have big impacts, so I try to be very careful, to not break the model. ( Starting over can help, but its so tiring) So I will see how it works out. I might do it with a modifier, but I will see how it works.

    I might have more to come today. At some point I want to rig the characters, to get them easier in position, but this is in far future.

    cya
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Jeu 21 Aoû 2014 - 0:33

    Had not much time lately, but started to give the amigos a try too. Have to work on the details, and instruments. But at least there are four now.



    Dernière édition par kunlan le Jeu 21 Aoû 2014 - 0:35, édité 1 fois (Raison : img edit)
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Jeu 21 Aoû 2014 - 21:51

    Impressive! What does it look like when subdivided? I'm already picturing them textured with nice materials and a bit of bump mappinp. Nice job.
    I imagine you are now going on with the rigging process. That is what I'm learning to do in Blender right now since my scythe needs a basic skeleton too (so I can fold/unfold it the way I want). Yesterday I learned how to use "constraints" that let you link some properties between objects. I rendered that little and totally unrelated to Manny's desk gears animation : gears

    Still no response on lucasforums. It's a shame. Those posters look great.
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Jeu 21 Aoû 2014 - 22:57

    Hey, the gears look nice man. "Constrains" are an important thing, especially for bodyparts and also stuff like the scythe=) Would like to see more, even if its not Manny office related. I also like the visual style, pretty neat.
    Will subdivided them and show it here. I hope you are right about the nice materials, they are going to be a small challenge, after the instruments =D After that I am going on with the rigging process.

    I subscribed to the Unreal 4 Engine for a month and this steals my time right no. Nothing good came out of it yet, but its fun. Do you have experience with engines?

    Yeah, the GF forum was also down for some days. Would really love to print out the posters, they are so visually compelling. Lets wait and see=)
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 28 Sep 2014 - 19:14

    Salut! Sorry haven't been updating as of yet. Doing an internship for 5 months now as a part of my studies, and cannot tell when I am gonna map these guys. Hopefully soon! =)
    Any news from you side? Best regards ! =)
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Dim 28 Sep 2014 - 19:53

    Hi! No news on my side. I've been working on an articulated scythe, really basic stuff. I intended to model a basic working skeleton and then add some mechanical details and ornament. The basic skeleton is the furthest I've achieved.
    I also tried to physically simulate wires (in order to connect devices to the computer like the typewriter or the screen). In the end I decided I would manually model it using bezier curves since it seemed to looked fine and glitch-free compared to physics simulation.
    I'm also allowed to use fracture_hectic's posters so I'm going to officially add the flyer related subscene I showed on lucasforum and the coral thing that may end up on Manny's secondary table among books and miscellaneous stuff instead.
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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Dim 28 Sep 2014 - 20:55

    Hey Shad, no news?=) You seem to be doing pretty well. Sounds great, thanks for the update. A mechanical skeleton does sound complicated, hope the best for you.
    Also great news with the posters, its a great addition to the table.
    Overall good news, steady process. Let see what the next few weeks will do.
    Manny :D
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    Shad

    Messages : 2901
    Date d'inscription : 06/09/2011

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par Shad le Lun 10 Nov 2014 - 18:22

    UPDATE
    A new lamp! Say goodbye to the ugly previous one. This is a mash up of different desk lamps. This art deco lamp's materials now need some fine tuning and a nice but subtle texture to add realism and grunginess. Maybe the lampshade is a bit oversized. Tell me.





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    kunlan

    Messages : 16
    Date d'inscription : 06/08/2014

    Re: Création 3D : Bureau de Manny

    Message par kunlan le Mer 19 Nov 2014 - 20:00

    Man I really like this one, looks like the office is missing, also the table and the rest. Great work! Hope to get to my work very soon, bye bye =)

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